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HomeMy WebLinkAboutConservation Comm 08/24/1976,Conservation t'ommiooiOa Meetiai August 2011976 8:11 pm members presents Paul Boyden, David llevnew, .>tuart Sweet, loris 'Hebb Others ,present Margot Jellinek Stuart Sweet read the minutes to August 10, 1976, meeting. Paul Boyden started the four orders of condition for the North F"tory Pond. they ari: -,(1) definitely use straw in the operational gravel work; (2) put up a 61 fence for protection, (3) that the pumping station authorities be notified during the work period so that pumpingwould be at a minimum or that any appropriate action be taken, and 14) that the Town of Mansfield restore any 'slopes Of grass :in those areas that have been disturbed. 1- A'35 ll1 Si:IJ �S7 0�t Paul Boyden first stated that the meeting; tonight is not designed, nor -will he allow it.to,be, to cause any problems between lard taking. This concerns itself with the wetlands area and any water on your property. Whether it remains ,your property, 01• should the State take it, is academic. I have nothing to do with'it. Each resident stated his name and address and approximately where 'he I s located in relation to where 495 is going and what hio' story with the State has been. Louis Garland, 861 Vilest St.: Mr. Garland stated that he h;as a pond on his land and that _the culvert that the State is putting in is 55' from the exist- ing`culvert. He also stated that Mr. Mooney from the Dept. of Public Works was at has ;house on 'Thursday, August 19, with a letter enabling the State to dig a pond equivalent to the existing pond. Later that day Mr. C'hareth came to his house and measured 55' from the existing culvert to the new culvert's locution, the pond., and assured him the road would be U.St,along the property line. The pond would be dug 3-4 .feet just as the exi9ting pond,. ussed the Twin 6001 problem and Paul stated. Yawl Boyden and Louis Garland disc that it will be emphasized in the Urders of that,especially at the beginning ofthis project, much more attention and more frequent cleaning of the ditch must be made so that we will know if the thing is working correctly} and i.f we get a siltration problem, then we will know what is causing the problems downstream. Mr.' Garland was also concerned about the moving of West Street closer to his property. ``lie mentioned that Mr. Mooney came to his house on 'Thursday with the-blueprints.and showed him the low spot and said that a storm drain would be 'built to prevent flooding intoliy property. Bill Gross, 860 'West St.; Mr. Gross stated that he has severe water problems. He Jeels that Hodges Brook should remain as is and not be shut off. The Brook has been undermined because of the new highways being built; the Brook has enough` water, Lis it is. Mr. Mooney told him that if they shut the Brook off, the water would be diverted .underground and that he would not get any more water problems. Mr. Gross said to Iutr. Mooney that if they did shut the Brook, he ,would want them to fill it in. Mr. Mooney said he. thought the State could not do this. I �I.�.}j'1 Db SCUS91 ola V2—' p Paul commented that when he talked to the State, he, had the understanding that if they did divert Mr. Garland's water, they would allow a reasonable amount of water.to`flow.through the Brook. Paul also said that the Commission's intent isnot to do, completely away with Hodges Brook, nor to increase any flow that could cause flooding. He mentioned CCdF's trench that could handle anything. Doris Webb asked if there was always water in the CCAP trench and the answer was yes. Mr. Garland said that he was under the impression that Hodges Brook would be closed. Paul replied that the State would be doing both --putting in a- ,restricted,pipe and .... Leo .Parente, JM 640 West SO Mr. Parente asked if this would be set up so that the water _could or could not flow through the existing water in Hodges Brook. Paul replied that the Commission's recommendation was for a portion of water still to flow through the Brook-�-water that could be controlled and flow through the,CC&F trench when it became too excessive - Mr. Parente xcessive.Mr.<Parente stated that the major problems started when they drained all the waiter from the watershed behind. Datsun to the blest St, area. This is when the culvert was knocked out on West St., and the State replaced it with a bigger culvert, which shows there's much more water now than there over was. He 'thinks if would be fantastic to shut off Hodges Brook, but, the way the land is now, it has to be filled in. Mr Gross said that Hodges Brook took care of all the water. If they shut it 'off, piping the water underground, the residents would still have surface i water and drainage problems. Stuart Sweet said that if they shut off Hodges Brook on the north side,of West St., and pipe it down and then across, that should effectively dry it up. Dave Devnew asked .if they had.done something to the CUF trench to keep the water from flowing downstream. 1' Paul°Boyden summed up'that they shouldn't shut .the stream off completely, but -to put a restricter on it so that some of the water will maintain a flow, and also to divert excess'water. Lbo Parente stated that the CC&F trench should be dug deeper. Paul Boyden told each of them to tell the Commission what they would like d6ne and'why. Bill Gross replied that he want the Brook to remain exactly as it was --clean and running freely, so that it will act as a vacuum and drain the hater in tike area. If the Brook has to be taken' he would want it filled in and the property trought ap to the level where it was --about a foot. Leo Parente's reply was that they do not want the Broyk, but have reservations about not having; it. He said they wart to see the land filled in the way it should bei and the channel for CUP dug seeper. Stuart Sweet replied that that is the only rthing that will get the water out of the backfield--i.e., deepening the trehch.- He also feels that the trench is causing any backup of water. Dave Devnew agreed to that. t � I I Discussion ®�- 8ebb asked if there is always water in the backfield and Mr. Parente 3 yes. Parente said that he would like to see Hodges Brook dried up, i oyden said that he doesn't know if the Town has any legal ground to e:CC&F trench deeper. Doris mentioned the agreement: between CAF and on for.CC&F. to monitor the water coming from School St, into Hodges If CC&F is retaining water, something should be done. oyden told the West Street residents that he would call Boston Tomorrow t any preliminary elevation plans they have. rland presented his letter and plot plan,to the Commission. old Leo Parente to tell his father to get his plans in also. He said herei!i.s no coordination between the groups in the State. 'Paul also here=will beIanother meeting with more thoughts from the residents uesday, August 51, 1976,, and that he might ask the State for an ion to review the case. ellinek asked if sediment ponds will be taken care of by the State; cleaning and maintenance, so that the Town will not be burdened with ra Boyden replied that it would be in the Orders of Condition. sionended Capproximately ,10.00 p.m. i i i uabers'p hers;pr t on Commission Meeting 6:116:11p.m. 1976 resent: Paul Boyden, David Devnew, Stuart. tweet, Doriq Webb esent Margot Jellinek ,S DTt>Cu:;SIU' Mrs. Evelyn Allen, 379 Franklin St. Mrs. '1'hibeault David T.hibeault, 551 Maple `.3t. Joe Piasecki, 30 Winter St- kttorneys John Michelmore and Garrett; Spillane, 83 Mechanic -St., Foxboro ssion began at approximately 10:00 p.m. en told everyone that he did not have the transcript from the Hearing naay, August 16, heoause it hall not yet been finished by the secretary. 11 make it available to anyone interested as soon as he sets it. He also everyone to state their :interest and what they want accomplished. Tile t rn will explain what Home Developers is trying to do. Barrett: ' seat ke` 3, stated n in u i pillane, representing the `l'hibeault°s and Mrs, Allen) said that Home s was only concerned with the front lots on Maple St., according to s of Intent. en replied that home Developers is proposing retention on Lots B anil C, he is draining them roughly 250' over and underneath Franklin St. --not ieault showed several pictures he took and marked them according to and lot numbers. The pictures were taken in the Fall of, 1974 shortly •colation tests were taken. len stated that the retention areas would divert and hold when they ,hat water, '.after reaching a certain Height, would be flowing back in action by Lots D and C. They did not say that there would be any more ;ss water Bitting this property than there is now.They will build a LOS of a certain ,height and retain it with restrictive sues on the ,new stated that two 72p1 pipes will be installed. 3pillaneiasked where the retention areas were. Sen replied Green Acres drive, Lot A and Lot C. he also said the ant of this.area would have very large lots in terms of square fobt- to the nature of the lots and the swamp area that is already there. i den and Mr.'splllane agrees that in the Orders of Condition will be hat "any division of Lots A,H or,C that they must be returned to the tion Commission for approval, i lane asked if thelcomi ssion had their own engineers Paul replied that use the Town engineer, hire one, or use Mr. Maloon. The Commission L considered calling in a. hydrologist for this case. Yr.,S,pi]lane also w the watershed will be controlled; if there will be specific areas for retention in the Orders of Condition, and will there he certain for these areas? : ` „k Green Acres Discussion cont, -5- Paul Boyden replied that the retention areas are defined on the preceding pages, We do not yet know who is responsible for the maintenance of these areas, and who 'will make sure that the retention areas do not get cluttered or who will own the 'retention areas. Doris Webb commented that they will be using the silty :Land that is there for retention areas and not do any additional digging. Mr.;Spillane asked if there was ever an easement taken. He also said .that there were :three 12"l pipes running into the road and that there is no live drainage into Maple St. John Michelmore commented that the pipes run perpendicular--not--parallel to ,the road. Mr. ,Spillane was concerned with the volume of water flowa.ng-through these 12" pipesq and what is going to happen across the street when all thin water is accumulated in the area. He wondered how high the wstar comes before it starts 'flowing.` Paul Boyden said he doesn't recall the hei6ht--maybe 2 or 3 feet, He also said that the engineering position is: that if we restrict the pipe to allow no more .flow than what is there, that if you do get a 100 -year storm, it can't -go through anyhow, we have a`dike above it, so the water will go in this direction, which inturn will go in that direction and will have the river there to take care of it,; --the tributary of the canoe River. The engineering concept; is acceptable --I i.e., restrict'the flow and it can't go over -the dike holding it, and so it backs back. It will then be picked up by the stream and will in no way affect, these people. Green Acres Drive will run alongside the dike. The map of the elevations will be something to look at. ,Nome Developers will be knocking down hills and silting into other areas. Dave DeVnew's primary concern was how long can a 12" pipe, 250 feet long; run? How many 'twigs and leaves can its take? Paul said that the whole flow of ground table water is in the direction of whiteville Pond which isacross from their property. Mr. Spillane asked if lIone Developers will leave the vegetati= Poul did not brow. It was not a requirement of the builder to specify. Mr. Spillane was concerned;if there will be flooding if the vegetation was removed,iior lowered. Doris Webb said that she understood Ralph Maloon to say that they were not digging retention areas but just shoving it back into the swamp. if that is true, then we have never dealth with such a type of retention area, Paul said that for all practical`,piirposes regarding Lot U in that particular area, it will not be dug out or touched; it is a natural sponge; the only thing they are loins� is diking; it. Gdrrett Spillane feels that the water is going to disperse acrid create a problem for someone :else Vince the retention area is not going to be built and grassed. (Even though there is a dam, the water will.go "where else.l Stuart Sweet felt that the water would not disperse since the contours are all going up. 1t is already as natural bow, he said, and where is it going to? i e6a i en Acres Discussion cont. Spillane answered that it depends on the type of material. If it were clay* would be all right. AS Webb commented that they said if they 60 not disturb what s at Ithere,ort it l hold because it is actually the bottom of the swamp, which *yish. in kdichelmore said there is no road through it. They would just poi, gravel it. 11 Boyden mentioned their experience with Palton Pond and the engineer's Won that if yqu dig out retention areas, the chances are there will be water there, and :it would end up on the other side. That is exactly what e Planning Board told Mr. Aoutas that he could not do. Mr. Maloon feels at-l;,y disturbing it*'would cause more problems downstream than if you ft it in its natural condition. t will go to a lower level-- wart Sweet said that if he digs it out, if. nter St. or Whiteville Pond or wherever. � ul said the land on the front lots has to be removed to gravel. He told yo eryone than the plans'can be looked at anytime. is Piasecki's problem is that the water spills over onto the road. Stuart reet asked if it is.ireelto flow. 'Joe .replied yes. Joe also said iVkiteville nd cannot :take care of ,the water on Winter St. He said the water comes up er the .road during heavy rains in the Spring or after heavy winter snow-* )ris,asked how deep it gets and Joe replied that the land was filled in about Not and that the land is now wet, not flooded(because it was filled asked if A would oe said he and his 'family own some o£ Whiteville Pond. haul elpif Whiteville Pond were cleaned out, Joe replied it would and Marie aldwin, his neighbor who also gets water, would agree to that; too. Paul entioned Jim Willis and how W formed a group to contact landowners, best ascribed in the Assessor's Office, to go along with his project. The ommission cannot cleanjout these ponds, because we do not own them. Paul hihks something like this could alleviate many problems in Whiteville Pond. rs,'Thibeatalt had no comments. She said Mr. Spillane said it all for her. !avid Th.ibeault was concerned with the elevations of the land. Paul. felt ,hat he had :reason to be concerned. 'aul was asked whenihe would receive the brief from Mr. Spillane, since the Jommassion-hays only 14 more days to answer or request an extension, which' ? w s. m7•� nservation Committee Meeting (Continued) gust 24, 1976 mmittee Members Present: Paul Boyden, Chairman David Devnew Stewart Sweet Doris Webb ,hers ;Present: Margot. Jellinek Is. Jellinek was concerned with the matter of Bungy Associates, south and rrthboundklanes of Rt. 95 into Bungy Lake. There was a 1973 gravel permit m 21 :acres. You can take gravel in an agricultural zone. When he came )r an extension, there is no plan that shows what it looks like, how far __ has dug andwhat_he, plans to do. Mrs. Jellinek also said that he will ave to drain in order to get at the gravel. She went to Coogan Environmental ater'Polliution Agency, 600 Washington St., Boston, Mass. ,The Conservation Dmmission must see the plans and the area must be covered on foot to see hat it looks,like in back of where a lot of gravel has been taken out. rs. Jellinek feels that too 'much gravel is taken out and that it is tipping lready. You cannot see what he isl doing unless ,you fly over it. 1, she aid,hm sorry to say, but we have no bond on that gravel removal. rs. Jellinek said that he got his extension after two years instead of one nd that there is no bond. Paul replied that he is covered by the Grand ather's Clause. Mrs. Jellinek replied that the Grandfather's Clause is a airytale. I n sum the main concern is draining the swamp to get gravel. Doris Webb sked when the ,hearing was, Mrs. Jellinek replied September 7, 1976. She No said that Chad Maurer saw Mr. Slattery, an attorney. Planning Board. ras to make recommendations. They meet Wednesday, August 25, and will see if it coordinates with what is on the ground. Ors. Jellinek; said she saw Mr. Coogan during May, 1976 and that `he talked to'Dennis Hannon. 'aul Boyden said that Mansfield does not own this land in question. Rezza, awns,it. Mrs.Jellinek said that it will have an effect on Bungy. Paul replied,again that Mary Richardson does not own this land. Paul told Doris to'get familiar with this matter and that Fred Rys should, too. it was voted that Robert Libbey will be the consultant. for. Kingman Pond. awd ;evnue-made the motion to accept. Paul 'read Mrr.'Day's letter. Kingman Pond dropped about a foot to a foot and a half. There are three options: (1) do nothing, (2) fill it ih; and (3),finish ,grading of the pond] Hispond does not have a face. It's the way the terrain and 'corner turned out. David Devnew said he was for making it even. The final comments .were that Mr. Libbey will give his,recommendations to ;sir. Day. Thrt meeting ended at approximately 11:30 P.M. 1) P; Senn to lawn Clerk ti I '